1800 roman video

[seawarrior]

 Hi 

       Found this on youtube worth watchin  both even if you dont speak the language!

             Seawarrior

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jbrVQNWmGLc&NR=1
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jbrVQNWmGLc

[Jimbo]

Wow!

I would say those folks take their Romans seriously!
Thanks for the link.

Best regards,
Jimbo

[Gepetto]

Thank you Seawarrior for the links, I saw this early on in my Playmobil days but could never find it again. I especially like the donkeys with the gear and tents.

Okay, now I know how many is too many. The ideal number seems to be between 20 and 18,000, Richard did you find an optimal size for an army or unit of figures? Did this information come too late for you?


Gepetto

[Richard]

Okay, now I know how many is too many. The ideal number seems to be between 20 and 18,000, Richard did you find an optimal size for an army or unit of figures? Did this information come too late for you?

Much too late, Gepetto ...

However, Eighteen Thousand Romans does appear to be a bit over the top ... 

Thanks for the link, Seawarrior ... 

All the best,
Richard

[Timotheos]

My only complaint about this film is that obviously the woman sitting close to the camera is hot, but the documentary shooter seems more concerned about the scrap plastic on the table.

EDIT:
Hokay, I watched it in more detail and have some bonafide complaints:
For all the project's concern for accuracy, the Romans clumped their baggage mules together and didn't distribute it between each century.  Am I correct?  Is Justindo in the house?  At the head of the legion, the skirmishers marched and along the flanks rode the cavalry.  Baggage was somewhere towards the middle rear, behind the officers, who also rode in a group. 

-Tim

[Gustavo]

As a matter of numbers,
sorry if they speak so in the video ... well, this is for those who don't understand German

a legion (legio) was 4000 men,

10 manipuli disposed in 3 lines (first line, the hastati, 1200 men,
second, the principes, 1200 men,
third, the triarii, 600 men, plus a thousand men, the uelites.)

triarii
iii   iii   iii   iii   iii   iii   iii   iii   iii   iii
principes
iiiiii iiiiii iiiiii iiiiii iiiiii iiiiii iiiiii iiiiii iiiiii iiiiii
hastati
iiiiii iiiiii iiiiii iiiiii iiiiii iiiiii iiiiii iiiiii iiiiii iiiiii

The manipulus on the first 2 lines had 120 men,
60 men for centuria (which is odd, cause it should be a hundred ...
maybe Asterix le Gaulois was right about Romans!),
in three lines of 20, side by side,
the right column commanded by an elder centurion (centurio),
the left one by a younger one.

(And the manipuli on the 3rd line with only 60 men.)

So, a (120 men) manipulus would be something like this:

     i            i
iiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiii iiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiii
iiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiii iiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiii
iiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiii iiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiii
     i  i          i  i

In the scheme that I have here, it isn't said what is done of each officer, in the total number, but it says that each manipulus had 4 officers (the two centuriones, and two officers at the back of each centuria), and 2 men carrying the colours at the front of the manipulus, side by side with the centuriones ... This would be six more men per manipuli.


Besides this,

the plays those guys are willing with playmobil certainly have nothing to do with clicking the clacks ...

Well, there are many kinds of plays.


G.
 

[Timotheos]

Hi Gustave

You're describing the Republican legion.  The cohort superceded the maniple as a tactical unit after Marius reformed the army and professionalized it.  The Hastati-Principes-Triares distinction didn't survive into the imperial era, except as nominal distinctions for one's row in the cohort (originally, the Hastati were young less experienced men, the principes were experienced troops, and the triares were seasoned veterans past their prime).  The velites ("uelites") were lightly armed skirmisher troops attached to the hastati and principes.  The maniple army you describe was a non-professional army levied in times of war.

Most of us Roman fanatics (if me and Justindo count as "most") estimate that Playmobil's Roman theme most closely matches the army of the 1st to 3rd century AD.

Supporting evidence:
1) Playmobil doesn't provide velites (part of the old maniple army)
2) Playmobil legionaires wear the gallic-style helmet of the early empire (the hastati-prinicipes-triares on the contrary wore a domed helmet with feathers).  Playmobil's legionaires also wear the so-called "lorica segmentata" (laminated armor), an armor from the imperial era.

Side note:
As for the Roman "century" having only 60-80 men, I read somewhere that originally this figure included the velites, and after the velites ceased to be part of a century, the reduced count became the paper norm.

In reality, Roman armies probably rarely marched full paper strength.  I'm reading a book about imperial cavalry by Karen Dixon who argues that cavalry units were lucky to have a full contingent of horses.

-Tim   

[Justindo]

Hokay, I watched it in more detail and have some bonafide complaints:
For all the project's concern for accuracy, the Romans clumped their baggage mules together and didn't distribute it between each century.  Am I correct?  Is Justindo in the house?  At the head of the legion, the skirmishers marched and along the flanks rode the cavalry.  Baggage was somewhere towards the middle rear, behind the officers, who also rode in a group. 

-Tim

Tim, you're indeed correct that all the baggage mules of each century would be grouped together towards the middle rear of the army while on the march.  The cavalry would also ride spread out at the sides of the column with some in the front and rear as well.