PlaymoFriends
General => News => Topic started by: Wesley Myers on August 23, 2011, 20:05:37
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http://www.independent.com.mt/news.asp?newsitemid=130159 (http://www.independent.com.mt/news.asp?newsitemid=130159)
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Very interesting :o! I guess that was quite an offence.
Ace :brownhair:
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From what I understood the main issue was that he was selling bootleg PM?
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It seems he was selling reasembled playmobil klickies form left overs ... playmobil has said that they dont mind reselling proper sets or klickies... they just hate selling of customs, modified, or similarly produced klickies and accessories..
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I thought it was all about them being made from inferior-quality parts.
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i don't get it...we're not allowed to customize playmobil figures and sell them to other people?
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I think that Geobra only gets peeved if that happens in bulk or in an "organized commercial form" (= store).
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dammed, thats why i dont get that cheap stuff anymore.. lllooooooooooooooooooooooooooooool 8}
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Certainly the Playmobil you could get in the Valetta Sunday market was not legally sourced.
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Those klickies he sold were leftovers for bad printing mostly. I mean they didn't pass quality check in the factory. I know this store in Buggiba, they sold souvenirs for tourists (we got two Malta magnets there for our fridge).
Best,
Arnaud
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Those klickies he sold were leftovers for bad printing mostly. I mean they didn't pass quality check in the factory.
There IS a quality check for printing? They must sleep a lot on the job...
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"The court noted a stark difference in quality between the dolls originally sold by Playmobil and the ones sold by Mr Difesa"
Hmm... question now is which ones were the better. ;D
@Playmobil/Geobra: just joking :P
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Am I the only one who flinches at the term "playmobil DOLLS" ?
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Am I the only one who flinches at the term "playmobil DOLLS" ?
The Maltese term for klicky was lost in translation ;)
We call them 'pupi' ... literally, 'dolls'.
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And all Playmobil rejects are meant to be ground up for recycling. This can be done by outside companies who buy the figures to grind them up, but maybe one of them didn't.
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Yes, I think the issue was not the customizing, but rather how the parts were acquired. At least that's what I got out of it.
@tahra: yes, that bothered me, too! :lol:
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Here most people (non-Playmocollectors) call Playmobil-figures " Playmobil dollies" (dollies ="poppetjes" in Dutch)...
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We always called them 'mannekes' (little men in Flemish) :lol:
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We always called them 'mannekes' (little men in Flemish) :lol:
way to much hype about malta stuff. in every firm are people who stealing stuff.. mostly comes it from asia..
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way to much hype about malta stuff. in every firm are people who stealing stuff.. mostly comes it from asia..
I haven't seen any of these bootleg bags in years, to be honest.
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I haven't seen any of these bootleg bags in years, to be honest.
Playmobil Malta had a crackdown on market traders a few years ago and that seems to have more or less ended it.
I remember one year when we were in Malta for Christmas and in the Sunday market in Valetta, that someone asked on of the sellers if he had any Christmas figures, "No," he answered, "but I can get you some for next week."
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Am I the only one who flinches at the term "playmobil DOLLS" ?
They're Action Figures! :hissyfit: ;)
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http://www.timesofmalta.com/articles/view/20110913/local/accused-turns-up-with-playmobil-court-replica.384582
from today's times ...
::) ::) ::) ::)
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This is the same case of the beginning of this thread :hmm:?
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some of the replies are very interesting...
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Defence counsel Joe Giglio, asked the police superintendent what car he had. Supt Magri said he had a nine-year-old Peugeot and before that he had a Skoda.
Dr Giglio asked him whether he had authorisation from Skoda to sell on the car. Did he have authorisation to change its tyres.
The Superintendent said he did not have authorisation, but no official complaint was filed against him.
No... but if you bought the car from him, and then tried to sell it, could the superintendent stop him? :hmm:
And could the superintendent sell the car without Peugeot having him put in jail?
To me, this is a ridiculous case. :hmm:
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To me, this is a ridiculous case. :hmm:
I agree... plus I know Vicky and she has been great always and a very honest seller.
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To me, this is a ridiculous case. :hmm:
Agree.
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so it goes. maltese courts are still trying maltese writers in 'obscenity trials' - in the year 2011 - so ...
::) ::) ::) ::)
then again, i guess there are worse places to live. and PM is still cheaper than other places. im currently in strasbourg ... specials are selling for 4 euro each 8} 8} 8} 8} 8}
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specials are selling for 4 euro each 8} 8} 8} 8} 8}
WHAT? :o :o :o
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WHAT? :o :o :o
Yeah. And blisters for 5 50. The old pirates feast set, the one with the bald klicky, 25 euro. With such prices, no wonder there are so many homeless people around ::) ::) ::) ::) :)
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way to much hype about malta stuff. in every firm are people who stealing stuff.. mostly comes it from asia..
So because a lot of people do something wrong, that makes it OK, does it?
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so it goes. maltese courts are still trying maltese writers in 'obscenity trials' - in 2011
That is a good thing.
Trying people for making Playmobil custom creations and selling them is not.
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re the former, you are joking, aren't you?
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so it goes. maltese courts are still trying maltese writers in 'obscenity trials' - in the year 2011 - so ...
::) ::) ::) ::)
That is a good thing.
Trying people for making Playmobil custom creations and selling them is not.
re the former, you are joking, aren't you?
We're going off topic here, maybe you could discuss this by PM? :)
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:) :) :) :) :)
Sure thing Pollyanna :P
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They were STOLEN
Illegal sale of Playmobil figures on Ebay and at Bugibba
Posted on June 15th, 2009
Following investigations into reports made by the Playmobil company in Malta, the police arraigned two people in court, accused of breaching intellectual property rights by illegally selling stolen Playmobil figures.
Francis Difesa, a 51-year-old man from St Paul’s Bay, and Nadine Cutajar, a 26-year-old woman from Ghaxaq, were separately arraigned with distributing these stolen figures and with breaching intellectual property rights. They both pleaded not guilty.
Nadine Cutujar was also accused of selling the Playmobil figures on Ebay, while Francis Difesa was accused of supplying a Bugibba shop with these figures. The shop owner will be charged separately in the next few days.
Playmobil representative Anna Agius told the court that the figures had not been made to the normal Playmobil standards and could also jeopardise the jobs of the 800 workers working at the factory. She also said that the Playmobil figures were being sold at ridiculously low prices at the Bugibba shop. She also added that some of the figures hadn’t even been put on the market.
Playmobil Malta had reported the theft of various figures and their parts and that they were being sold on Ebay and from a shop in Bugibba. The figures included modified knights in various macabre poses.
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They were STOLEN
Illegal sale of Playmobil figures on Ebay and at Bugibba
Posted on June 15th, 2009
Following investigations into reports made by the Playmobil company in Malta, the police arraigned two people in court, accused of breaching intellectual property rights by illegally selling stolen Playmobil figures.
Francis Difesa, a 51-year-old man from St Paul’s Bay, and Nadine Cutajar, a 26-year-old woman from Ghaxaq, were separately arraigned with distributing these stolen figures and with breaching intellectual property rights. They both pleaded not guilty.
Nadine Cutujar was also accused of selling the Playmobil figures on Ebay, while Francis Difesa was accused of supplying a Bugibba shop with these figures. The shop owner will be charged separately in the next few days.
Playmobil representative Anna Agius told the court that the figures had not been made to the normal Playmobil standards and could also jeopardise the jobs of the 800 workers working at the factory. She also said that the Playmobil figures were being sold at ridiculously low prices at the Bugibba shop. She also added that some of the figures hadn’t even been put on the market.
Playmobil Malta had reported the theft of various figures and their parts and that they were being sold on Ebay and from a shop in Bugibba. The figures included modified knights in various macabre poses.
this one is a different case from the one we've been discusing yesterday... in fact there must be more cases in Malta I suspect. 8}
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Goebra moved the factory to Malta to exploit cheep labor and now they complain that they do not act the same as high paid labor :hmm:
Sorry Geobra you can not save your cake and eat it too :hellol:
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If they move the factory here I'll work for what I can carry home with me... they can keep the money :)
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Goebra moved the factory to Malta to exploit cheep labor and now they complain that they do not act the same as high paid labor :hmm:
Sorry Geobra you can not save your cake and eat it too :hellol:
I don't see why cheap labour should be assumed to be less honest than high paid labour. In fact, when you look at some of the cases that get to court, it's the high paid people who fiddle the books and cheat on their expenses.
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Not getting into the debate if cheap labor is the problem (and I don't think it is), if they really have the practice of taking "parts home to assemble sets and figures", it's a sure recipe for disaster.
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Not getting into the debate if cheap labor is the problem (and I don't think it is), if they really have the practice of taking "parts home to assemble sets and figures", it's a sure recipe for disaster.
I believe that assembly at home now is rare and possibly even ended as new machinery has been introduced some time ago which assembles figures automatically. In any case, from what I heard, the problem was not the home workers so much as parts and figures being smuggled out of the factory.
The question of what is cheap labour is a difficult one, but "cheap" doesn't necessarily mean poorly paid.
EDIT: Moreover, cheap labour in itself doesn't lead to low labour costs per item produced, and that's what manufacturer's are interested in.
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Something I just noticed here is that the two cases may be related the 2 individuals in the 2009 case would seem to be suppliers for the current case. If this is in fact what is going on here, then it really is just one big stolen goods case... IE not as big a deal as it would seem.
Note: not that theft isn't a big deal but that these kinds of cases happen all the time everywhere and have no effect on 99% of what people are doing.
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I don't see why cheap labour should be assumed to be less honest than high paid labour. In fact, when you look at some of the cases that get to court, it's the high paid people who fiddle the books and cheat on their expenses.
Really, ok if that is how you view it you certainly are entitled to it. Cheap factory labor usually do not have any access to any accounts that would give them the opportunity to do such things. The only opportunity they have is to fill their pockets with some misc. parts. Yes at the end of the day the white collar crime will add up to more loss in $$ seeing as one person can steal millions with the strike of a computer button and it would take years or low skilled, cheep labor thievery to add up to those figures. On a per case situation I put my money on the daily little stuff that goes missing.
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I think underpaid workers are indeed more likely to steal from their workplace.... little pay = employee discontent = lack of company loyalty. If you pay workers next to nothing, you can't expect them to be fiercely loyal. not there aren't a lot of people out there who are honest under all circumstances anyway. But low wages don't help with those who are slightly inclined to resort to stealing (which truth were known is probably most people if they're desperate enough to feed their families). For one thing, as I said, they are more desperate for money, but also, if they get fired from that low-paying job, they can always move on to the next low-paying job. That fact can be seen from all the gum-chomping minimum-wage workers at fast food joints and grocery stores here. They have no pride in their work or company loyalty, and so they don't care if they do their job well or not, there's nothing magical about this job, they hate it anyway. Except of course for the conscientious few, who shine like gold, and quickly get promoted, or get a better job offer, so they don't stay long. Then they are replaced by another gum-chomper.
Pay your employees well, and treat them well, and you have a better chance at someone who takes pride in their work and is loyal to the company. Not a guarantee by any means, but a better chance.
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There IS a quality check for printing? They must sleep a lot on the job...
:hmm: :hmm: :hmm: :hmm: why so?
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there's nothing magical about this job, they hate it anyway.
oh yes there is !!!!! being together together with all pm ,and being part of the production ?? (http://smileys.on-my-web.com/repository/Zen/levitation.gif) (http://smileys.on-my-web.com/repository/Zen/levitation.gif) (http://smileys.on-my-web.com/repository/Zen/levitation.gif) how much do they pay them anyways.. so low? :hmm: :hmm: i don't think this is the reason though ,your statements have a base but if someone wants to steal he will steal always the money wants more money !!! so nothing to do with how much he gets
anyways what's the concusion??
can you sell customized playmobil ??
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your statements have a base but if someone wants to steal he will steal always the money wants more money !!! so nothing to do with how much he gets
That's quite true, but many of them don't get too far in life, either.
As to can you sell customized playmobil, who knows? Maybe this trial will help us find the answer.
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I think that PM would like the answer to be NO ... but depending on what country you live in and what freedoms it allows, the answer is probably going to be Yes, of course you can... but Malta might be a place where the answer becomes NO. Of course this would apply only to customizing and selling it rather than to customizing it for personal use...
BUT I see no way to stop collectors from gifting their customs to one another and coincidentally giving each other monetary gifts. :lol:
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There has to be more to the story than Geobra not liking people making customs and selling them. Are they printing them, or is it just a way to go after someone they think is associated with the thefts. A company spending lots of money to stop people from customizing toys and then a year later release customize your own klicky in surprise bags is very odd. I think some info is not disclosed as it might be either embarrassing or creates further tension in the work place.
If geobra moves the factory it would cost a lot more than this will. From what I heard Malta is not that cheap of a place to do mindless repetitive business labor anymore. Perhaps its time to open a factory in Somalia :captain:
I agree that it is a tactic to scare people and it works, for a while :hehe:
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i don't understand if you legally buy figures from sets and then sell them customized ,what is the problem? :hmm: :hmm: , i don't know this consept is really weird or something hidden (http://smileys.on-my-web.com/repository/Others/others-081.gif) (http://smileys.on-my-web.com/repository/Others/others-081.gif) (http://smileys.on-my-web.com/repository/Others/others-081.gif)
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Hmm I wonder if someone feels the need to unload a lot of misc klickes from you know where :hmm:
Look here (http://www.ebay.com/csc/commandodamato/m.html?rt=nc&LH_Complete=1&_fln=1&_trksid=p3911.c0.m283)
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:hmm: :hmm: :hmm: :hmm: why so?
Because a lot of them look like I painted them...
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There are two threads going on this and the common theme in both is that parts were stolen from Playmobil one way or another. Remember, newspapers in reporting always like to get the public's attention and so their reports pick up on something minor to the real case and make it major. Looking at the Times of Malta reports, the common link between the 2009 reports and now is that the parts were stolen and the customising element is something of a side issue.
Turning to low pay, what's low pay in one country is high pay in another and so when Geobra moved some work to Malta it was because labour costs were lower there than in Germany but this doesn't mean that Geobra's workers were paid low wages compared with the general wage level in Malta. I imagine that they were above average for the island. In addition, wages are not the only means of payment and Geobra, like many German firms also offers non-monetary rewards to its staff.
As for mindless, repetitive work, it can actually be quite nice as you just do the job and then go home. I've quite enjoyed supposedly mindless, repetitive work when I've had it in front of me. Creative work? That's tiring!
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Hmm I wonder if someone feels the need to unload a lot of misc klickes from you know where :hmm:
Look here (http://www.ebay.com/csc/commandodamato/m.html?rt=nc&LH_Complete=1&_fln=1&_trksid=p3911.c0.m283)
:eh?: :eh?: :eh?: :eh?: what seems weird here?
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i think playmobil wants us to customize.
http://kind-baby.marktplaats.nl/speelgoed-playmobil/455974492-playmobil-uniek-zeer-oude-set-om-tekleuren-nieuw-ongebruikt.html?return=eJwtjl0KgzAQhO8i6KM%2FUSlGpNSbpJrWYEwWd6Xa0rt3Q33a%2BWYGdpQs5MfIvEUpRC0j1GodpnYiApllswft0kWtM4FVijB1NvtXUpjgutuuSEbsyMflLS572PjmLEZzGnAalli8DWOPjxEZihDTGS%2Bh57ZFr2YI7Z2xudR1GeBgqISoikDzi4nHHIu%2FGxuLWuSbM3rmyGP4KhLz5FUAW5cnhEF6pMGPuitF00Tt9wc1f0oj&fta=eNo10Vtu5CAQBdC9IKW%2FeWMK9RZmCy2ePSjuNgp24kyUvYeyJ39Hl6IoFR4MfHWYgGxv8%2B3dz524DkwwIPt8ZZfUr%2BsCrm1AXaoDbWBe4V9trpc0Sl1bR%2FRo8Nwe%2Ba1GN%2B9gjVLCzZ8gOZdMuNcPaLP%2FfCyhzi%2Bcbs%2BaX93SK%2FBLvY9XWtuu9LJ25NLXuKR8FdxanEUCaf6eiavjrQ4CSE3HkIIqICJ4JkNgO4vJUG01QijLDIJ7quiZGCpPSMNOsIzFMU6UJkTQSk8IKwTFmmi0CdgnUpVoGQjeyEgPcOuxOChRPEdIngv28bLwCZPJ8qDwuskhZ2xohNE8DujMpMYjLWQw5QDPQh%2BgReKRGo0mTEShotidhULjxE9MOfiBpD0X7IC1YtwKKkjNxhiBJ5tVRBhOjdx%2FF3V%2BL5B1aT7125yf9%2FXv73ItkIffb7jvseJ0ZByI%2FyDuz3%2B%2BE%2BeBwtf39w%2FaX6xz&fta_ind=32&fs=1&thumb_click=1#photo
But just in the mind of playmobil. I mean no ww2, KKK, hitlers no jezus hanging and that kind of stuff