PlaymoFriends
General => Brainstorming For Playmobil => Topic started by: Rasputin on December 22, 2009, 17:29:49
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Hello PlaymoFriends :elf:
We received our lego catalog today and I once again noticed some very similar themes. The first one that stood out was the Fantasy Dragon Knights that lego is making :hmm:. The dragons are purple and the knights have flame eyes and lazer looking staffs. Then a few pages later a new Fire theme with trucks just like Playmobil's :hmm:. The other sets were movie license's so we will not see Playmobil doing any of those but the others we just so similar.
So I ask you, Who is coping whom. I know there is research , then design, then mold making, then production time and all this can take years before a set hits the shelf. Are there spy's to get the same themes on the shelf at the same time ? what do you think?
Rasputin "The Mad Monk"
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If you also notice the new city super sized construction series in LEGO seem to be the same as the new Playmobil large quarry equipment series! It seems it would be easier for LEGO to jump the gun because of components readily available with just minor additions of development.
I have also noticed the LEGO AGENT theme that is similar to PM's New ADVENTURE series with the harpoon launchers! As far as who's first in coming up with the original concept idea, we may never know due to each company's devout secrecy :shhhh:! However both companies product introductions are timed very close, therefore I can't vote due to not really paying attention to LEGO's contribution timing :hmm:!
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I'd be interested in seeing the new fire trucks, Ras. I feel that Lego are following PM (maybe better to say copying Playmobil). I've seen a number of Lego sets recently which mirror, for example, the new construction sets which came out a couple of years ago in PM. I just can't find them on the Lego site.
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Even when you take out the licensed themes, Lego seem to have more current themes than Playmobil. Pirates seems to have made a return, possibly due to the continued success of Playmobil's pirates, and their Castle theme is still going strong.
Lego seem more inclined to add humanoid monsters like trolls, squidmen, and aliens, and I'd like to see more of these from Playmobil. So far bunnies and space aliens have been the only non-human humanoids.
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I suspect it goes both ways. There probably is a little spying on either side when possible. LEGO has had continuing success with their Space theme, but it was abandoned ages ago by Playmobil and hasn't seen any comeback. That's one area I would like to see copied over, especially the more realistic Mars series LEGO did.
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Hi :elf:
I can not seem to find any of the sets that are in the newest 3-D Brick Master's catalog. We get one ( actually 3) every month and each time I notice some set or theme that is just too close in design to be dumb luck. This time it was the Dragon sets that really stood out. I can take a picture of the Fire trucks if you want to see them but just imagine Playmobil sets in Lego's. A ladder truck, pumper truck, smaller 4x4, a helicopter and a station with roll-up doors and slide pole.
I too do not follow Lego's enough to make a call on who was first so I thought somebody in here might know more ???
Rasputin "The Mad Monk"
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I can take a picture of the Fire trucks if you want to see them but just imagine Playmobil sets in Lego's. A ladder truck, pumper truck, smaller 4x4, a helicopter and a station with roll-up doors and slide pole.
Rasputin "The Mad Monk"
Thats one thing I have always liked about LEGO fire stations is the large roll up bay doors! PM could have used the door from construction set #4043 in place of the folding ones actually used in set #4819 but chose an inferior design instead.
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The fire station set pre-dates the PM one, Ras.
I'd expected the roller door, Bill, on the new fire station (unfortunately, the 4819 building is a bit short to take a 3880 unless you remove the winch) but the type of doors PM have used are common on the Continent and in the UK.
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Hi :elf:
I guess this is where things get confusing. Playmobil takes years to get an item to the shelf. Lego seems like it could get an item to the shelf much quicker. Like stated all they have to do is change brick colors and print new boxes. Even if Playmobil designed a new set that year, Lego could possible get a set out the next year were as Playmobil would lag by a year or more. This would of course require a spy to know what theme and design Playmobil's team is up to.
Do we have any Lego collectors who know when a theme got introduced. If you take the Fantasy Knights, if Playmobils was introduced (what?) 1/2009 that puts it at a possible blueprint phase in 1/2006 ? (guessing here) so when did Legos come out and how long from print to shelf?
These companies must know and somebody is really frustrated over there by these coincidences. The Dutch and German design team wars :P
Rasputin "The Mad Monk"
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I'd expected the roller door, Bill, on the new fire station (unfortunately, the 4819 building is a bit short to take a 3880 unless you remove the winch) but the type of doors PM have used are common on the Continent and in the UK.
I understand the dimension restraint Gordon, but they could have incorporated the current design utilizing the roller door sections into the vehicle bay section & using an open interior as already being done, just design interior tracks for the doors to slide within.
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fwiw, Lego Pirates will be on indefinite hiatus from mid 2010 onwards:
http://brickset.com/news/article/?ID=372
You could always pull up a couple of comparisons where Lego follows PM's lead (eg, in construction):
PM 3262 Electric Crane (2003)
LEGO Tower Crane http://brickset.com/detail/?Set=7905-1 (2006)
PM 3263 Cement Truck (2003)
LEGO Cement Tuck http://brickset.com/detail/?Set=7990-1 (2007)
-however, there was a simplified on released in 1985 http://brickset.com/detail/?Set=6682-1
You can go to brickset's database and look up sets/themes, and when they were released by year (wished there was a similar site setup for PM items!), or what sets in each theme were release for any particular year. I've just picked 2 that so happen to show PM's earlier introduction.
My interest in Lego has been mainly the Technic and Creator/City range, which is a little hard at times for a direct comparison with PM, theme-wise - for the boys we've given in a little and let them pursue the Star Wars range (not just a licensed product, THE licensed toy product! ack! what am I thinking! ;D) - so with somewhat a foot in each boat, I can't help but notice that it is a little more than mere coincidence - I'll put it this way: there are quite a couple of times when our 9 year old would say something like "cool, Lego's finally got this (which PM has a similar product).
my 2 cents ...
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You can go to brickset's database and look up sets/themes, and when they were released by year (wished there was a similar site setup for PM items!), or what sets in each theme were release for any particular year.
http://www.playmobil.de/on/demandware.store/Sites-DE-Site/de_DE/Search-Show?cgid=ARCHIV
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Hi Core :elf:
Thanks, you seem to know a lot more than I do. One of our boys really likes Legos and we have a lot of it. I just do not like how I can not play with it and that has always kept me with Playmobil. I look at the catalogs with him to show interest in his interests and just keep seeing very similar sets.
Rasputin "The Mad Monk"
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I understand the dimension restraint Gordon, but they could have incorporated the current design utilizing the roller door sections into the vehicle bay section & using an open interior as already being done, just design interior tracks for the doors to slide within.
They sure could, Bill, and someone on klickywelt has made their own version. My reference to the 4819 building was because I had been thinking of buying some of these to make a fire station - sorry I didn't make my line of thought clear. Of course, it's always possible to make one without the rear section of the building being used.
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They sure could, Bill, and someone on klickywelt has made their own version. My reference to the 4819 building was because I had been thinking of buying some of these to make a fire station - sorry I didn't make my line of thought clear. Of course, it's always possible to make one without the rear section of the building being used.
Using the front half would work for sure Gordon! In this country all I have ever seen is electric driven roll up doors, either glass or solid with small windows! BTW, if you find that custom station again, please let me know.
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Hi :elf:
Do we have any Lego collectors who know when a theme got introduced. If you take the Fantasy Knights, if Playmobils was introduced (what?) 1/2009 that puts it at a possible blueprint phase in 1/2006 ? (guessing here) so when did Legos come out and how long from print to shelf?
Rasputin "The Mad Monk"
I can't speak to the actual design phase of a whole new theme, but I could ask a LEGO Community Ambassor if they knew. I keep up to date on the new LEGO set news and when stuff gets leaked. I remember for the Summer 2009 LEGO lineup had leaks from it preliminary set/box designs back in August 2008. The images were pulled by TLG and we didn't see conformation of the designs until the Toy Industry Association (TIA) show in Feb 2009 with worldwide relase in AUG 2009. The sets started to appear on ebay :hissyfit: in April and May, perhaps taken from their packaging plant in Czechoslovakia and were on store shelves in NA by Late May 2009 (The "August" Release appears it mean it will be North America and EU 2 months earlier)
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but I could ask a LEGO Community Ambassor if they knew. I keep up to date on the new LEGO set news and when stuff gets leaked. I remember for the Summer 2009 LEGO lineup had leaks from it preliminary set/box designs back in August 2008. The images were pulled by TLG and we didn't see conformation of the designs until the Toy Industry Association (TIA) show in Feb 2009 with worldwide relase in AUG 2009. The sets started to appear on ebay :hissyfit: in April and May, perhaps taken from their packaging plant in Czechoslovakia and were on store shelves in NA by Late May 2009 (The "August" Release appears it mean it will be North America and EU 2 months earlier)
Hi VCR Klicky :elf:
Yes if you visit the site and do not mind asking :wow:
Rasputin "The Mad Monk"
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http://gizmodo.com/5019797/everything-you-always-wanted-to-know-about-lego (http://gizmodo.com/5019797/everything-you-always-wanted-to-know-about-lego)
• How long do they take to develop a theme, all the sets, start to finish?
Over the past few years we have been able to dramatically decrease the time it takes to develop and produce a new set. The average development period is now about 12 months from start to finish, down from 2-3 years previously.
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In 2004; during the Playmomeet in Zirndorf, we had a chat with a designer (I belief he was the head-designer; but I am not too sure about it anymore).
He did tell us that were designing two years ahead. Meaning that the themes and sets that were released in 2009 were designed in 2007.
Bogro
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That's the same lead time I've always understood to be the case. If anyone keeps old catalogues it would be interesting to see when, for example, the last of the old fire theme disappeared from the German catalogue. I guess it would be 2006 or 2007.
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i really have no way of knowing. ???
in the past i have seen playmobil "riding" megablocks sets in the pirate family - http://www.playmofriends.com/forum/index.php?topic=2856.15. :'(
so, i believe it is possible that playmobil is also copying lego designs. ::)
in all the information available in this thread one thing struck me - lego is abbandoning the pirate theme in 2010. :o
the same seems to be happening with playmobil. ::)
i heard somewhere (maybe it was here, i don't really remember) that pirate toys were having a problem - it could be said that they are not "morally compatible" with the recent somalian pirates attacks...
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i really have no way of knowing. ???
in the past i have seen playmobil "riding" megablocks sets in the pirate family - http://www.playmofriends.com/forum/index.php?topic=2856.15. :'(
so, i believe it is possible that playmobil is also copying lego designs. ::)
in all the information available in this thread one thing struck me - lego is abbandoning the pirate theme in 2010. :o
the same seems to be happening with playmobil. ::)
i heard somewhere (maybe it was here, i don't really remember) that pirate toys were having a problem - it could be said that they are not "morally compatible" with the recent somalian pirates attacks...
Hi Cachalote :elf:
If your info on Lego's discontinuing Pirates is right and the way Playmobil has been showing less interest in the theme it would now be the 2nd origonal theme loosing steam. The Medieval sets have seemed to be on the decline also.
It is unfortunate that the main stream media & Hollywood can now have such an impact on the Themes of toys. I see the Somalians as modern day Robin Hoods. Robbing from the rich to feed the poor, but thats just how I see it.
Rasputin "The Mad Monk"
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the lego information came from core's link in this thread - http://brickset.com/news/article/?ID=372. ;)
the somalian "link", as i said, came from "somewhere". 8}
i don't see pirates as you see them rasputin.
i find them a bit more complex than the "plain" robin hood - distributing wealth to the poor gained from the rich.
i think this happens indirectly - pirates just can't control their urge to spend all they have.
gilles lapouge, in his fantastic book, talks wonderfully about this kind of "hatred" for wealth that pirates seem to have. they either spend it all as fast as they can or they bury it in distant shores or caves.
if you are interested in this theme, amazon has an american edition quite cheap - http://www.amazon.com/Pirates-Buccaneers-Gilles-Lapouge/dp/1844301192/ref=sr_1_24?ie=UTF8&s=books&qid=1262029757&sr=8-24
it is worth every penny. :wow: